I don't want to start a mud-slinging campaign, but I'd like to make a general comment in the interest of getting the right signals to the right people in time for them to make informed decisions. CREN's executive director never wrote to this list. In fact, CREN very seldom replies to complaints posted to LSTSRV-L (this assertion can be verified by examining the list logs). I am certainly not trying to say that this is the way things should be, nor that this discussion is not an appropriate topic for the list - it most certainly is! However, I don't think it is reasonable to expect CREN to take strategic advice from this list, or to change its strategy based on what technical people have to say. CREN may or may not choose to justify its recent decisions on this list, but what they are sure to do is to write a nice letter to your management explaining why you should migrate from the obsolete VM LISTSERV software to the new, modern, improved unix list management product that CREN carefully evaluated and selected for the greater benefit of its membership, and is going to enhance in the near future. Your management may or may not know the facts and issues at hand and, if they don't, they may be impressed by CREN's positive attitude to the changing world of computer networking and send in a membership check that buys you software you don't want to run. So I would like to suggest that you bring your concerns to the people at your institution who are in charge of approving software/maintenance purchases, renewal of CREN membership, and so on. If you think the product CREN purchased is not as good as LISTSERV, you should let them know so that they are prepared when CREN's letter comes in. I would like to say more but I absolutely can't open my mouth until I've asked a few questions to our lawyers on Monday. I'm just not very familiar with US laws and since comparative advertisements are not allowed in (most of) Europe I have no idea what the "rules" are and can't release the papers yet. What I can say however is that a number of announcements will be made over the next month, some soon and some after a week or two, because a number of administrative steps have to be taken before the announcements can be made, and unfortunately the administrations in question cannot be accelerated. In general the state of competition created by CREN's decision will be beneficial to the end user and allow you, the customer, to continue to use the products and services that YOU have chosen, under more advantageous conditions than possible previously. I realize this may sound like an electoral speech, but unfortunately that's all I can disclose for now. Eric