Responding to myself, with a gentle reminder from Pete Weiss :), I answered incorrectly. To get the list owner's refcard, I believe you have to specifically ask for LISTOWNR REFCARD. If you do INFO REFCARD you will always get the general user version. On VM, you may be restricted to which ones you are authorized to GET because of the FAC codes in the appropriate FILELIST. On the unix/VMS/Windows versions, these restrictions do not (after a short test) seem to apply. Nathan