At 03:14 PM 9/4/1997 EDT, Stan Horwitz wrote:
 We  have  many lists  which are  created
>either to supplement traditional in-class  discussions or to replace in-class
>meetings entirely.

Same here at idbsu.edu (Boise State U, in Idaho USA)

 The instructors  prefer to  subscribe the
>students to their respective lists so that  the students don't need to do so.
>This is done  so that students can  receive each message that is  sent to the
>list. The problem  is in finding out which student  has which e-mail address.

It seems to me that is the Instructor's problem.  If s/he wants to know
their email addresses, s/he needs to ask them and to insist that they give
it, and that they not unsub, since this is a key part of notes
distribution, class discussion, or whatever the purposes are.

If the Instructor wants the students to sign themselves up, perhaps with
approval by owner, then he also has that option.  But, I don't see how it
should be YOUR problem either way.  YOU"RE not the one who wants this.  If
he knows their names and ID numbers and has them in class (assuming that
ALL classes meet at least once face to face) (and if not, then s/he'd
really better have ways of contacting them), then why is it YOUR problem to
determine their email addresses?  Even if they don't KNOW their email
address on first day, since acct isn't set up, s/he can certainly provide
his/her address and REQUIRE, and enforce with sanctions (flunking comes to
mind) that they provide the email address by some date in the near future.

>We have no centralized e-mail address  database here, although we are nearing
>the end  of the development  of such a database.  This database should  be in
>production  soon,  but  it  will  be strictly  voluntary.  Many  of  Temple's

That's a step forward, and a good thing for you to do.  I'm betting that
most universities (if most don't already....and we don't) will have a
"unified/standardized email addressing scheme".  So that email to
[log in to unmask] will get to me, and you don't have to know whether I'm
[log in to unmask] or [log in to unmask] (I'm both but the
standard address of [log in to unmask] would point to one of them).  This
ultimately simplifies things as long as it is REQUIRED.  And there are
various ways you can harvest addresses from the various systems and enforce
it if anyone has the cojones to do so.  (And I'll bet a number of
administrators do if they're sold on it).  You can still allow people to
have other, secondary, addresses.  But having a central addressing system
allows blanket emails in emergencies (the campus will close for three days
due to the blizzard....Stan and a campus cop are in charge of the
University until then since they were the suckers on graveyard when it hit)



We do not
>recommend any particular ISP for students who have to pay a toll to dial into
>Temple's computer  network. Accounts on  computers at Temple are  also spread

We don't support ANY student dialup access.  The contract for such was bid,
and the winner has a system that works even for those who don't have a
credit card.  Some access for email as cheap as US$3.00 per month, prepaid.
 Of course they can go to any ISP, and some others have offered some pretty
cheap student deals in competition.

>Registration for courses  is done via an automated voicemail  system which is
>not  designed  to  record  student's   e-mail  addresses.  As  such,  I  have
>absolutely no tools for gathering this information.

Right.  You have no way to get all of it, even if you require folks to run
certain things on their servers.  We're moving to STRONG but reasonable
network controls at Boise State.  They won't hesitate do disconnect your
subnet if you do stupid things, like running vast quantities of streaming
video for fun, across multiple subnets and the backbone, pretty much
crippling it.....one school tested that and lost.....they didn't believe IT
would really enforce it.  After 24 hours they gave in.  o-)

>Does  anyone  else  operate  course-based  Listserv lists  in  this  kind  of
>unstructured environment? If so, how to  you deal with the problem of finding

Yes. As mentioned above, we're pretty decentralized, and students use all
sorts of ISPs.  We consider it the Profs Problem....not mine.  Yeah, I get
students who can't manage to sub to a list without getting themselves
served out, those who don't put their correct email address in their POP3
client, etc.  If it is a working address, I forward msg to student and tell
them to contact me for help (they often don't know the name of the list,
won't or can't follow directions, etc.).  If it is a bounce from the return
address the student supplied, I forward it to the Prof and let him/her deal
with it.

>students' e-mail  addresses so that  their instructors can subscribe  them to
>their  courses' Listserv  lists? With  nearly 600  lists under  my direct  or
>indirect care, this issue is getting to  the point where what little sanity I
>have left is rapidly fading so any and all ideas are welcome!

The instructors have the ultimate control.....it is their class....they're
the ones that give the grades.  NOT YOUR PROBLEM.  You just need to beat
that into your heads, after making sure your boss agrees with you.  (If
not, let him/her develop some system to do what is needed)

dan


Dan Lester
[log in to unmask]
In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.  Erasmus, 1534