On Fri, 12 Feb 1993 11:03:39 EST Matthew Simpson <054340@UOTTAWA> said: >Now I know that PSYCGRAD must die. It's a real shame, especially given >the new digest features (not to mention all the others). I do think, >however, that it is a shame that the program won't work without RSCS in >a system. It's a great loss, I think. I will try one last time. First, you could move your list to any of the 280 other LISTSERV sites and maintain it without RSCS. Hundreds of lists are maintained that way, you know. Second, as I said the problem is not that LISTSERV can't work without an RSCS link. You could keep the list without an RSCS link, as long as you updated the configuration files to reflect the fact that you no longer had an RSCS link. You would lose functionality in that your server would be totally isolated, the rest of the network wouldn't know you run LISTSERV, subscription requests wouldn't be forwarded, there would be no DISTRIBUTE because there wouldn't be any topological information any longer, and so on. But the list would keep working. The problem is that U. of Ottawa will no longer be allowed to run LISTSERV, even for local lists, when they leave BITNET. The license is linked to the BITNET membership. This is a political decision I have made in order to inconvenience sites which leave BITNET to save a few thousand dollars a year. A LISTSERV that can't talk to the other servers is a royal pains in terms of user confusions and it generates a lot of questions and complaints to me, both from the local site and from users. In practice, sites that leave BITNET would terminate all network-wide lists because of the problems I mentioned, but would keep enjoying the software for local administrative lists. The users I wrote the software for can no longer use it, but local administrative tasks are not impacted. That is not what I want, hence the rule. If you think this is silly, let me give you an example. The rektor (head) of our university has arranged for an electronic debate on the privatization of the university to be organized, based on LISTSERV. This was successful and they now want to use LISTSERV for all sorts of administrative lists, it is going to be a key component in a wide plan to get rid of the tons of paper we get in our mailboxes. Now, say my management decided BITNET is obsolete and we should drop off to save a few thousand dollars a year. The rektor probably doesn't know or care what BITNET is - and why should he? This just isn't his job. If my management said we should leave BITNET, he wouldn't even want to know about it, and if someone brought it to his attention he wouldn't take any action - and why should he? But removing the administrative mailing lists to save a few peanuts is something he would never allow. The service is worth more to him than this amount of money - end of story. Within 6 months LISTSERV will probably be able to fully interoperate with servers without NJE connectivity. This version will be free to BITNET sites, and licensed to non-BITNET sites at a higher cost than the average BITNET membership so that leaving BITNET but keeping LISTSERV would not save you any money. Now, if instead of complaining on this list and posting misinformation, you had made a business case to your management saying that your teaching will be impacted by this attempt at saving a minor amount of money, maybe they would listen to you and change their mind. Eric