I do not think Natalie Maynor advocated that list subscribers should be allowed to reduce a list to chaos if the they so choose. I think she was saying that sometimes one should allow a list to develop so it will find it's own niche and become a vital list. Sometimes the initial idea for a list may be too narrow and it can't sustain itself. Sometimes the idea may be too broad and one has chaos from the start. I think what she was saying was be flexible (not lenient) and you will have a better list which is active and a dynamic force. If faltering memory serves, the late Kathryn Wright established a list five-six years ago intended soley for the discussion of rare book cataloging using a particular OPAC system. When it became apparent that many not using that particular system were interested in taking part she allowed the list to broaden its scope. But she would not have tolerated extended flame wars nor any of the sabotage/spamming/etc. material we have been discussing lately to disrupt her list. We allow our subscribers a fair amount of latitude. Most of the material is strictly on target. But list related humour is welcome, and when it is time for a major library conference meeting notices, requests for roomies, queries about accomadations/restraunts/etc. are normal and expected. The list is for catalogers and the material almost always fits what they want to talk about at the time. Flame wars (been two years since we had a real one) and totally extraneous threads that go on too long are dealt with as necessary. The list is required reading for some graduate classes. The list has been through a succession of listowners but the focus has always stayed the same and is largely determined by the subscribers (we've been fortunate not to have any interlopers bent on mischief, but they'ld have a hard time convincing anyone they knew what they were talking about on this list). Anyway, I think Natalie meant this sort of latitude to allow a list to "find itself" when she spoke of seeing herself as a mechanic keeping the list running and the subscribers decide what the list is. Douglas Douglas Winship Austin, Texas [log in to unmask] Secondary AUTOCAT Listowner