Well, Geert, don't you fell better for letting off some steam? ;-) I mentioned the 4 hour stuff as it is relatively new and seems to be becoming more prevalent fairly quickly. The old baddies I ignore as they are too ingrained in systems to worry about anymore. But if I see an error from IBM I generally assume it's a "format" item and delete it without looking, though check every once in a while but that's always what it is. One postmaster has deigned to answer my plea for mercy, said it's part of sendmail 8 and maybe the next version will handle list mail better. Wonderful, what about now? Douglas Douglas Winship Hays County, Texas [log in to unmask] Secondary AUTOCAT Listowner MEDLAB-L