Thank you Ben and you are correct I had meant to type server 2003 not
2005.

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: LISTSERV site administrators' forum
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ben Parker
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 5:12 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Upgrading from Listserv 1.8d to 15.6 and a new server

On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 15:02:18 -0500, "Demeny, Dave"
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>I wanted to see if I understand this correctly.  We will first need to
>upgrade the Listserv software from 1.8d to 15.6 on the old server then
>we will be able to copy these files to the new server or do we install
>the Listserv software version 15.6 on the new server and copy the files
>from the older version 1.8d to the new server?  

The L-Soft White Paper at 

 http://www.lsoft.com/resources/wp-movinglistserv.pdf

says to upgrade on the old server, also install new kit on the new
server, then
copy all files in all directories to the new machine.  (With some
exceptions,
for example do NOT copy the listname.DB* index message archive search
index
files nor the listname.INDyymm web index files, they are machine
specific to
the old server and LISTSERV will recreate them on the new machine
as/when
needed.)  This is deemed the easiest method for everyone to understand.

However, it is also possible to install a new copy of version 1.8d on
the new
server, using the correct 1.8d install kit (finding this is usually the
main
problem),  Then copy all files & dirs to the new server, then upgrade on
the
new server.  If done correctly, the end result is the same.  

The key points are you need to install the new version on the new server
so
that basic directories, permissions and registry entries are set
correctly for
LISTSERV to run.  When you copy the files from the old server to the new
server, you will be replacing the various binaries and other system
files that
have just been correctly installed in the new server with the files from
the
old server.  If you have, as recommended, already upgraded the old
server, then
files you will overwrite will be the exact same ones as already
installed on
the new server, so there will be no problems.  If you copied the old
files onto
the new server without first upgrading, you will have replaced some of
the new
version files on the new server with old version files and you have a
mess.

>I thought we first had
>to upgrade the software on the server then we could copy that to the
new
>server.  Since we only have 2 servers and one is our production server
I
>need to be careful to get this right so we don't loose service for an
>extended time.

There are 2 parts to the migration/upgrade process.  One part is
time-critical,
i.e. you want to keep the shutdown/out-of-service time as short as
possible.
However, other parts are not time-critical and can be done/re-done at
leisure
without affecting production service.  Planning is everything for a
successful
outcome!

Here is a hypothetical breakdown, you can add the time-scale and flesh
out the
critical parts.

(non-time-critical pre-migration)
Pre-Planning phase
trial-run/testing phase
notify users of planned interruption in service
install new version license on old server (momentary downtime)
install new version on new server (temp IP)
start LISTSERV on new server and verify operation, then shutdown again
set SMTPL.exe service to manual start

(just before entering time-critical phase)
Make system backup of old server
Run script to delete files not to be copied to new server (*.DB*,
*.INDyymm, 
 *.ERROR, *.MAIL-ERROR, out-of-date listname.OKxxxxxx files)

(begin time-critical phase)
shutdown LISTSERV on old server, shut down SMTPL.exe (incoming mail)
upgrade in place to new version
restart LISTSERV only, verify operation and successful upgrade
 if problems, resolve/fix or roll back
 if no problems, shut down again
copy files to new server
adjust IP addresses (transfer old IP to new server)
reboot new server, take old server off line
 LISTSERV only will have restarted, verify www operations
 start SMTPL.exe, verify mail operations
 resolve/fix any problems
(end time-critical phase)

(non-time-critical post-migration)
clean-up anything 
reset SMTPL.exe service to automatic restart
notify users of successful restore of service
retain files on old server for at least 1-2 weeks, in case of any issues
visit the local pub for celebratory round (step not endorsed by L-Soft
:-)
(end migration/upgrade)

Another important question is will the new server take on the same FQDN
(Fully
Qualified Domain Name) and IP address(s) as the old server?  If so, this
is the
best case.  However, if the new server will have a new name and/or a new
IP
address, then you have to work about mail forwarding from the old FQDN
and you
also have to worry about DNS propagation time for the change in IPs to
be fully
recognized by the global DNS system.  Both of these issue can be easily
managed
to minimize downtime, but the time to consider them is before you are in
the
middle of the actual migration.

>Sorry, I have more questions now that I'm thinking of until I sent the
>last e-mail.
>* Will we be able to run the new version of Listserv 15.6 on windows
>2000?  

15.6 is not yet released.  The current version is 15.5.  But yes, it
(and 15.6
when released) will run on Windows 2000.

>* When we upgrade Listserv 1.8d on Windows 2000 to version 15.6 will we
>be able to copy the files from that server to a new server running
>Windows Server 2005 or Windows Server 2008?

Perhaps you mean Windows Server 2003, there is no Windows Server 2005.
But yes, you can copy files over.  Windows Server 2008 presents certain
technical configuration issues if you are using LISTSERV with an ODBC
database,
but 1.8d was the first version of LISTSERV to support this.  Windows
Server
2008 also presents certain technical configuration issues in terms of
IIS
configuration.  But these issues are part of making sure the new version
of
LISTSERV is properly installed and running correctly on the new server
before
you begin the actual migration work.

>* Would it be best to have a 3 server to work with so we do not even
>mess with the production sever till we have the new Windows Server
>2005/8 with Listserv 15.6 running?

Yes, you want the new server tested and running before you do the
migration,
but you don't need 3 machines to do that.  1 machine (the new server) is
enough.

<begin shameless sponsor's promotion>
Finally, if your Maintenance and Support is current, you can ask L-Soft
Support
these and similar questions about the migration/upgrade process.  They
are,
after all, the experts.  Also, (and even if you M&S is not current)
L-Soft's
Consulting group can be engaged to work with you to plan and remotely
perform
the migration for you for a relatively modest fee.  Again, consult
L-Soft
Support and/or your L-Soft Sales Representative.
<end shameless sponsor's promotion>