On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 00:35:56 -0600 Steve Price said:
>On Mon, Jan 12, 2004 at 11:12:39PM -0700, Ben Parker wrote:
>>
>> Sorry, I made an incorrect assumption.  However, the explanation is the same.
>> The outbound MTA accepting the BSMTP mail 'package' from LISTSERV (regardless
>> of what program it is) must accept the entire 'package' (*.MAIL file) without
>> question, and without performing any validation, domain lookups, or whatever,
>> during the period that LISTSERV is sending.  Any such validation should be
>> done later, after initial acceptance, and generally while the MTA is
>> attempting to deliver the mail onwards to its final desitination.
>>
>> The Outbound SMTP mailer in LISTSERV is very simple minded and cannot deal
>> with 450 responses, and other forms of errors and will not manage its own
>> errors and retries at this point in the process.  Those are all MTA functions
>> that should rightfully be performed by the MTA and not by LISTSERV.
>
>I'm not sure I understand this bit of logic but I'll take your word
>for it that LISTSERV's simplemindedness is a flaw with most (all?)
>of the common Un*x MTA's default settings.


Well, using your logic, maybe you shouldn't be doing this job then
since you don't understand what's going on.  Don't like the gratuitous
snipe?  Maybe you shouldn't do it either before trying to understand the
situation.

The common UNIX MTAs have default settings for default usages.
Guess what!  Running LISTSERV isn't a default usage.  It's a special
case usage.  Guess what!  That means using special case settings
on programs.  Oh my, oh my.  What's a person to do?  Other than
reading the documentation, FAQs and trying to understand what is
going on and adjust to the new situation.

LISTSERV has a task to do, and it trys to do it well, and let
other processes handle their tasks.  Being an MTA isn't one of
LISTSERV's jobs.  As you note, there are several MTAs that do
a fine job.  LISTSERV does enough to give the data to the MTA to
let it do it's job, but unlike a human who may want to know right
away about an error in an email address, LISTSERV is handling
hundreds or thousands of addresses, and doesn't need or want to
know immediately.  It wants to throw the job over the fence, and
have the MTA tell it later about all the problems.  Think about it,
you have a user at your office, that has 1,000 tasks.  Some number
of them are going to have a problem.  Do you want them to give you
a phone call about each one as it is identified, or would you
rather receive an email with a list of all the problems?
If it was a one time situation, you might want the phone calls,
but if it happens many many times a day, you quickly won't
want the phone calls.

/ahw